Episode 229: Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder (FASD) – with Jessica Birch

The episode transcript is below.

Carolyn Kiel: Welcome to Beyond 6 Seconds, the podcast that goes beyond the six second first impression to share the extraordinary stories of neurodivergent people. I’m your host, Carolyn Kiel.

Carolyn Kiel: On today’s episode, I’m speaking with Jessica Birch, a national advocate and speaker living on the southeast coast of Australia. Since her late diagnosis of fetal alcohol spectrum disorder, or FASD, at the age of 33, she has turned her attention to awareness building and education to create a better understanding of the prevalence and consequences of prenatal alcohol exposure in Australia.

Jessica shares her lived experience in an effort to arm individuals, parents and carers, educators and health professionals with the information they need to create successful interventions and support. She believes awareness and action are key to minimizing the rate of prenatal alcohol exposure globally and works closely with organizations, stakeholders, and government on alcohol policy and regulatory reform.

Jessica, welcome to the podcast.

Jessica Birch: Oh, thank you so much for having me, Carolyn. It’s a pleasure to be here.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah, I’m really excited to talk with you today and learn more about your story and the type of advocacy for FASD that you do.

So I’d love to learn a little more about yourself and, and what it was like growing up. So you know, what was your experience like growing up with undiagnosed fetal alcohol spectrum disorder?

Jessica Birch: Of course. Well, you know what, Carolyn, in a word, it was hard. It was, it was very, very hard and, and lonely. And, and this is really despite having, for all intents and purposes, having a beautiful childhood.

I grew up in a very safe, supportive, loving, and structured environment. Yet there was this underlying sort of unexplained sadness that I carried through my childhood that, in many ways, and well, was very much sort of unexplained until it was explained. And it does, it, it, it hurts me a little bit whenever I say that I had a sad and sort of lonely childhood because within my family unit and particularly with mum, growing up with my mum and my younger brother, my mum worked so hard to provide everything that we needed and provide just really beautiful fun experiences when we were growing up. And we had so many beautiful experiences growing up. Yet the, this, these difficulties and this sadness sort of remained in me. And my mum really felt that. And she knew and didn’t know what to do about it. And I know that that, as I grew up that was something that really broke, broke her heart. You know, that was a really hard time.

But to sort of paint a little bit of a better picture of what sort of FASD looked like for me as a, as a kid, I have significant issues with, and very typically of a FASD diagnosis, I have issues around my executive function, my adaptive function and affect regulation, which is my emotional regulation, my memory, my attention, learning, things with academia. I have quite significant sensory issues, sensory regulatory issues, issues with my proprioception, which is those sort of internal feelings of the body and as well as damage to my nervous system.

So if you break that down a bit, you think about all those higher order skills, like initiating a task, setting a goal knowing how to problem solve, flexible thinking, time management, planning, prioritizing, social interactions, social participation, understanding the social cues, being able to block out competing sounds being able to learn through verbal instruction, you know, you know, the list goes on and on and on.

And I was not only dealing with these sort of cognitive challenges and learning challenges as I went through, as I developed throughout my childhood but I was dealing with quite a lot of physical symptoms of my nervous system. So I had quite severe exercise intolerance, for example, because I had a really elevated heart rate. I had a lot of symptoms of presyncope, so or postural tachycardia. So when I was standing, you know, I, I would often get, symptoms of dizziness, nausea, that sort of thing. And as a 10 year old, you, you know, for example, you don’t really, you think everybody’s experiencing that. You think all the kids, having these same experiences and you have no context, you have no way of sort of separating that, those feelings and that experience from what is, what was happening for everyone else and what is, you know, as a child, what is normal and what is not.

So, I, I, went through my childhood and the schooling experience with many, many of these challenges. And as much as I was supported in my family unit it, it really wreaked a lot of havoc.

And I’ll just say quickly, I don’t want to talk and talk and talk at you, but I I’ll just say quickly, that there was just, there, it was obvious that there was a few quirks there. And, but I was a bright and engaged kid for the most, for the most part. I didn’t present with these really extreme behaviors that, you know, people sort of flag and then sort of go, Oh, wait, there’s, there’s a problem here. And because I have strong language skills, all these difficulties were hidden behind this sort of, this smiling face and this, and this little kid that was kind of willing to try and learn, but yeah, definitely sort of fell behind. And, and as demands increased, so too did the difficulties.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, as you said, you described really a wide variety of experiences and challenges that you had. And as I understand that, that can be very common for FASD is that it’s a kind of a range of physical and cognitive and, I guess in some ways emotional because you talk about being kind of very sad and depressed as a child.

And you know, with a certain level of, hiding it behind that, you know, being very bright and great at language and, and smiling, that can make it hard, I guess, to really say that something definitive is wrong. And again, you say, because you think everybody goes through it.

Jessica Birch: Absolutely. And, you know, it’s, it’s easy to fall through the cracks with that sort of presentation when people don’t, aren’t looking through the brain lens, you know? You know, if there’s no, there’s no awareness around what these brain based behaviours look like, then it’s really easy, if a child is not presenting with these really extreme sort of, yeah, again, behaviours, symptoms, outbursts, challenges, for it to be missed or for it to be chalked up to other things.

So you know, some, some of the issues, like, for example, some of the sense, some of the auditory processing things mum realized quite early on and I was getting sort of assessed for that. And there was a few other things as well. And what was always sort of brought back is that, “oh, you know, she’s a smart kid, so everything’s fine. And you know, everything is behavioral and she’ll just grow out of it,” which is kind of, it’s a bit ironic because it is behavioral and it is like, but you don’t grow out of it. It, it changes and amalgamates and, but the, the challenges. are there and and they do remain.

So it, it was really difficult. It was, it was a hard time. I was a, I was a child that, I don’t feel like I was particularly rebellious. My mum, my mum might have something else to say about it. I feel I was pretty, like pretty under wraps. I was one of those kids that really wanted to do well in school and really wanted to please. I’ve always been a bit of a overachiever. Let’s just say that. And, and so I aligned myself in child, in my childhood with the kids that, you know, were achieving and were the brightest and the smartest in, in, in the class, and so, and were excelling in, in different ways. And, and that’s what I really wanted. And I wanted to be seen as the same.

And from very early on, I inexplicably felt other. And there are a few reasons for that. But the biggest reason is, is that I had undiagnosed FASD and I was functioning in a different way to the other kids and I didn’t realize. And I was just desperately, desperately trying to fit in and fulfill this I guess this childhood vision of myself and, and the groups and the group of children that I thought that I should be a part of. And, it was, and there was different difficulties that came through with that.

Carolyn Kiel: So how did you eventually realize that you had FASD? Like, how did you even learn about what FASD was?

Jessica Birch: Again, I just have to, praise my mum for the, for this. This is quite a, I will try and give a shorter, sort of abridged version because this is this is, was quite an ordeal and it was a, it was a long battle, you know, kind of 10 years and a lifetime sort of thing.

I am, I was finally diagnosed just before my 33rd birthday. I’m 38 years old now. So it’s been nearly six years since my diagnosis. But the diagnosis, and I’ll explain a little bit deeply, more deeply, but, the diagnosis came four years after we realized that it’s likely that I have FASD. So there was four years to obtain the diagnosis, but that realization of FASD came almost 10 years after a very, lengthy health battle, both my physical and mental health. And I was really at a point where I was desperate for help and I was in, and I was desperate for change. It was in, it’s a very, dark time in my life.

And so, I had been basically from the time I left home, of course, transitioning from childhood to into adulthood for individuals with FASD can be very, very difficult. Just because of the, that, you know, having all those sort of higher order, like “adulting” skills, most of those skills in individuals with FASD are broken or they work intermittently. And so it’s very difficult to navigate an adult life without support and guidance and help. And of course I, I didn’t want the help. I wanted to come out on my own and I thought, you know, that I was going to go and make something of myself. And, you know, I was going to do it all on my own and I didn’t need my mother anymore. I was an adult and this and that, the other thing. And I’d had a very difficult time in high school. I wasn’t, I wasn’t a particularly happy chappy.

But anyway, I went off, I did my life, you know, I started my 20s and I left home and I traveled and got a job. And I just, I started to find things progressively more and more difficult. And I had more and more sort of physical symptoms and significant issues with fatigue and brain fog and other things.

So, I started seeking help. I realized when I was about 22, something was quite wrong and that I wasn’t managing very well. And and I started seeking both general and specialized help. However, what happened for me is I got trapped in the healthcare, in the mental healthcare system. And so, of course, I was very anxious. I was very depressed. I had dealt with years and years of difficulties and hidden years and years of difficulties. You know, very good masker. You, you learn how to mask when you, when you’re not diagnosed, and you become very, very, very good at it. So yeah, a lot of the challenges were really underneath the surface. And but my function functioning for me in the world became harder and harder and harder and harder. And it got to this point where I was so ill and I do have secondary diagnoses, and secondary sort of disability.

And my mother stepped in basically. I I got to about maybe 26 27. I just finished school. I, I did go back to uni for two years and that experience nearly killed me. And I don’t, and I don’t mean that in, to say that to be melodramatic. It just the pressure and the, the, the responsibility of, of trying to complete that, I, I hit my limit at that point. And I’ve essentially, this was more than 10 years ago, and from that point I was no longer able to work. I was no longer, I was, I was basically bedridden. And my mum stepped in, and I was deeply depressed. And my mum stepped in and was like, “no, something is very wrong. Nothing that your doctors are saying is sort of answering what is going on here. We need help. This, this can’t stand.” And it was my mother who stepped in and supported my health care journey from that point on. And it took about, I think it took about two years.

And we were looking at a lot of autoimmune, I was, symptoms, like, I had a lot of autoimmune symptoms. So we were looking for an autoimmune disorder. It didn’t really address the cognitive issues that mum had seen throughout my life. But we didn’t know what that was, you know, and it didn’t make sense in our, in, in our awareness why that would be happening.

Eventually so after a couple of years, my mum happened to be watching a reporting TV show on in Australia. It’s called Four Corners. I think there is an American version actually. And, it happened to be an episode on FASD. And it was a mother and her children and they were talking, they’re adult children, and they were talking about their experience of that, of FASD. And my mum was watching it. I wasn’t there. My mum was watching this and she’s, and she’s like, Oh my God. This is what’s happening to my daughter. This is what, this is what it is. This is the problem. And so she started doing a ton of research and started to try and really connect the dots to look at the issues that I’ve had throughout my life and the issues that I was having now at the time. And this was about 2016, 2017. And she started compiling all the information and trying to make the connections and sort of see, hey, you know, this is, this is what it’s looking like.

She spent time doing that and then she came to me and she approached me about it. We don’t, I we don’t live in the same state. I, I live, I have to fly to my mum. She, I live in a city called Melbourne and my mum’s in Victoria, which is on the southeast coast. And my mum lives in, on the northeast coast. So when I went to visit my mother, she sat me down and she said, “look, this is what I think the issue is and, and this is why.” But funnily enough, I always knew my birth story. So I always knew that I had been exposed to alcohol. And if anyone, at any point, any doctor, any health professional from like the age of 10 had asked me, had I been exposed to alcohol when I, when I was in mummy’s tummy, for example, I would have been able to say yes. When I was a 16 year old and I started visiting doctors on my own, had anyone asked me, I would have been able to say yes. It’s just that no one asked and no one made the connection despite presenting with complex problems. And so when my mum broached it with me, I rejected it outright. Absolutely rejected it. I, I said, “how could you possibly say this to me? How could it be that? You don’t know, you don’t know, I’m not listening to you!” As you do as, and I was so upset and I was so frustrated that she had put that forward as the solution because my knowledge of what brain based, what a brain injury looks like and what brain based behavior looks like or, but more, sorry, to be honest, more generally what a brain damage looks like, I just thought that that meant that you weren’t smart. That’s what I thought. And I know that it, in, in instances, it, it can affect intellect, it can affect IQ and that’s very unfortunate and that’s, and it’s very sad and that’s why I advocate as strongly as I do, but that’s all I thought that it meant. And, and I’ve, I, I and you know, I’m, I have regrets about not having that, that knowledge, but you know, but that’s what I thought my mum was telling me.

Carolyn Kiel: Ohhh.

Jessica Birch: And and I, and I rejected it. It, it hurt what I had hoped was going, was my, my, my view of myself, you know.

So what she did from that point was start really collating research, surveys, studies, assessments, case studies, all sorts of things. And over the course of a year, she compiled these into folders for me to read. And so the next Christmas I came to visit her and she told me, she said to me, she’s like, Jessica, I have created these folders for you. If you read these folders and after you read them, you do not think that you have FASD, I will never bring it up again. And if you read them, I will take you on a holiday.

Carolyn Kiel: Incentives, wow!

Jessica Birch: Incentives, bribery works. Gratification works, instant gratification works. So I started reading these documents. I started reading the research and I started reading, and of course, I’ve got good memories of what my child, you know, the difficulties I went through in my childhood and where I struggled.

And I started reading through the information and I got maybe an hour in and I burst, not even actually, and I burst into tears. And I was like, oh my God, this is me. This is, I don’t even understand how this document could possibly be written because they don’t know me. So how is it so accurate?

Carolyn Kiel: Mm hmm.

Jessica Birch: And essentially the journey started from there. And I would say that was Christmas 2016, and it was from that point that we’re seeking diagnosis. But that is not easy for an adult, and I know globally it’s not easy, as easy for adults, but it’s very, very difficult to obtain an adult diagnosis of FASD in Australia. But, we got there eventually, four years later.

Carolyn Kiel: Wow. So, yeah, it’s, it’s amazing. Your mother really was your advocate, like, through your entire life, just trying, you know, being so concerned about you and just never giving up in terms of figuring out like, what is wrong? Like, what is the issue and how can I help my child? And yeah, no, that’s, that’s amazing that she had the persistence, you know, with that year in between to bring it up again and to approach it in that way. And and to help you find those answers. Especially because I feel like, well, and I’m sure you know, because you’re an advocate and one of the things that you do is help educate and, and help with regulations around FASD and, and support and education around that is that it’s really not well understood. Like, I think people maybe have an understanding of FAS, which is a very small subset of FASD. But in terms of the whole spectrum of FASD, I think there’s a lot that people are still learning. And there are even some doctors, if you had even mentioned to them that, Oh, you know, my mother had alcohol while she was pregnant. I’m sure some doctors are like, “well, that’s fine. Like some alcohol is okay.” Like, it’s kind of amazing how there’s not like consistent understanding of the impact of alcohol during any point of pregnancy. Yeah.

Jessica Birch: It’s shocking. It’s absolutely shocking. And it is, and it was because of discovering FASD, learning about it, and then, of course, my diagnosis, and then realizing how it presents in individuals, the varying presentations in individuals and then how little is, is known about it, how little awareness is about it, not only in community, in like in our communities you know, parents planning a pregnancy, all of that, not just that, but health professionals. And the whole gamut of health professionals who have, really very, very little awareness and are to this day still telling women that they can drink in their pregnancy regardless of low levels regardless of what the, the sort of saying that low levels is, is okay. And it’s only sort of high levels that are problematic. And that is not true. I’m just telling, I’m telling all your viewers right now that is fundamentally untrue. We have no, we have no known safe level, there is no level of alcohol that we know that hits our cells that, that comes into our body and doesn’t cause damage. Particularly, you know, of course for a baby in utero.

My desire to really put FASD in the public consciousness is just because of how insidious it actually is. And what I see is happening is we’re getting this huge explosion of ADD and autism diagnosis in young adults and adult cohorts, without any questions or assessments being done around alcohol exposure, when these symptoms deeply overlap. And what’s happening is, is that you’re getting part, for many, many people, you’re getting part of the diagnosis with ADD, but you’re not getting the whole picture look. And that’s because the doctors and the specialists that you’re seeing are not asking the questions and, and they’re not seeing that, really that there needs to be sort of a whole neuropsych evaluation and all the questions need to be asked there.

And the reason that this is important is because causation is important and the, and we can’t minimize and prevent if there’s no accountability for the causation of why these difficulties are happening for you know, generations of people. But the other thing that I will say as to why a causation is very important is because autism and, an autism diagnosis versus a FASD diagnosis in where, where there are many, many sort of autistic symptoms or autistic traits, does require different interventions. The interventions are different, the way that the brain works is different. And so you will see similar symptoms, but the way that you handle those symptoms is different and so it’s always important to ask. And so when I discovered this and I realized that there were so many individuals such as myself that were struggling in this way, I just, I had to speak about it.

Carolyn Kiel: And so finally getting that diagnosis and understanding that you had FASD. How did that realization, the diagnosis, change your life going forward from there?

Jessica Birch: Oh, wow. It’s, it’s hard for me to put into words. Like, truly, it, it was like many things has happened for me, understanding the diagnosis, diagnosis and and coming to terms and embodying the fact and understanding the fact that, yes, I absolutely do have FASD.

One would I, I would say is that when, when this came about, when my mum intervened in my health care, I was in a very, very bad way, physically and emotionally and she was, she was scared for my safety and she was scared for my life. It was a very dark time and it was a difficult time for my family as well.

So I was at this rock bottom, bottom point. And I’d spent the last 30 years of my life internalizing every difficulty and experience and awkward interaction and failed exam. And, you know, all of these sorts of difficulties I even, like managing my left and right and coordinating myself, for example.

You know, all these things that I had experienced through my life, I had internalized and and it, it, it became, this is about me being defective. This is about, this is about me not working hard enough. I haven’t done this. I’m not this. I’m not that. I’m not this. So, and that was very strong. That was very ingrained. And I was, I, I had this this battle of self worth and self esteem. So I was at a very low point.

So, and you know, and I’d also been through the healthcare, and I’ll just say this as well, I had been through the healthcare system, regularly, and I had a, a, a lot of doctors, and specialists that essentially reinforced that message, that this was on me to change, that this was about me getting my head straight and trying harder, and this and that the other thing. And so a lot of, so it always came back on me. This is me. This is me. This is me. And I need to do better and I’m a failure.

So having the diagnosis and having a reason for there to be difficulties, not that, Oh, Jessica, you’re just dumb. Oh, Jessica, you’re just lazy. Oh, Jessica, you just need to try harder. To have, to go no, that there are significant difficulties here and that with support, you can overcome them. It was like, it was like this weight, this heaviness, this hurt, you know, this was able to lift. It created an avenue, diagnosis creates an avenue, not only for support in Australia, I know it’s different in the States and it’s different in Canada what you can access and honestly, I was in Seattle earlier this year speaking at FASD United, FASD United Conference and I have to say, I was deeply shocked with the lack of of disability support that that individuals can receive. Australia is better. We have lots of problems. That’s a probably a conversation for another time, Carolyn, but there are lots of gaps and there are lots of issues. Don’t get me wrong. It’s not perfect. But what it allowed was access to support.

And and so for me, not only was it a weight off my very, very tired, very, very depressed shoulders, and gave me a moment to sort of breathe and get a bit more understanding, it gave me hope for a different future. It gave me, it gave me an opportunity to go, Oh, hang on. I just didn’t have the right tools. I’m not a failure. I just need a different approach. And and I just need a little bit of guidance in these areas of my life. And if I get that approach and that’s, if I can go from that view, from that lens and that approach, then things can improve. And it’s been, it’s been, you know, it’s been a journey and I have, I have a lot of ups and downs. I’m very symptomatic in a lot of ways. I still have meltdowns. I still get sensory overloaded. Like all those things still exist. But what the change is for me is, is one, I have more understanding and support around it from the outside world to a point. Again, another story for another time. And also from my, in my, within my family unit, but I can give myself that understanding and support. And that opens, that opens you up for healing. And I really carried, I was carrying a lot of stuff that really no one needs to be carrying, and no one needs to be putting on themselves.

So what it did was completely change my sense of self. It completely changed my perspective of who I was as a person and how I viewed the world. But not only that, but it changed my perspective on how I view other people. And I think that what it has also allowed is me to have more, not only more compassion for myself, but more compassion for other people because now I can look through that, through the brain based lens and I can go, when I interact with someone and maybe that interaction might be a bit funny or there might be something that I don’t quite understand, I can look at brain. And I go, I can see that this is a brain based behavior, or I can see that there might be something going on there. And I think it’s given me more compassion and more perspective. And it’s allowed me to heal and use, this understanding and this knowledge to put the right support in place to help manage these difficulties.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah.

Jessica Birch: Completely changed my life.

Carolyn Kiel: Wow. And so, yeah, you mentioned that you can access supports that, that help you and, like what kinds of either disability supports or accommodations do you find most helpful for you in day to day life?

Jessica Birch: So a lot of people believe because of my strong language skills that somehow I’m, I guess, like, not very FASD. Or, you know, they or, but I do require, particularly to do the work that I’m doing at the moment, I do require quite a high level of support.

So I work predominantly with a social worker. I work with an OT, an occupational therapist. I have a, I had a specialized physiotherapist for quite some time, although I’ve transferred that to a different sort of service. I have support work, so I have someone that just comes to my house and helps me with tasks that I might need to do or just help me manage my schedule because my schedule is quite busy and that’s very difficult to sort of navigate all the priorities and times when I have to do things and not double book myself and make sure I get, you know, things done as I need to and also keep my household together. And you know, as you well know, I’m sure, you know? All the, all the adulting things. So yeah, so I would say predominantly my support is a social worker, an occupational therapist, a support worker. I do have a coordinator that sort of coordinates my my people, like my team together, which is, which is really nice.

But I also need help, for example, with reminders to drink water, and I don’t like to drink water. I have a lot of sensory things around it. I don’t like to swallow it. I don’t like the taste of it. I don’t like the texture of it. So I do have, even at 38 years old, I, I do have someone that helps me make sure that I’m getting hydrated and feeding myself, taking medication. I, I have support for all of that. I don’t actually manage it that well. I know that I need to do it, but I actually, so the knowledge is there. But the ability to manage and do it all is, is a whole different kettle of fish.

I do also get help with food prep and food service because of that. And then I do have different sort of sensory help as well. So for example, I have things like a weighted blanket and I use aromatherapy and, I have sort of sensory items that help me wind down. So yeah, I have quite, I have quite a number of supports to allow me to, to function to the capacity that I’m functioning at. And I promise you that before I had that support, I was not functioning this way. It’s a completely different world.

Carolyn Kiel: Wow. Yeah. So there’s so many things that can potentially be helpful for people and that’s great that you are able to access and, and use a lot of those and that they really do help you in your day to day. Wow.

Jessica Birch: It’s completely changed my world and I really, and the reason that I, I speak about this and I, and I, and I like to speak to the power of diagnosis and I like to speak to the power of support, even if, if our governments are not, you know, in your country, the governments are not supporting, but having that knowledge in your circle, in your community within your family unit, it can be hugely beneficial.

I know that there are a lot, there are lots of different situations why, and it’s important for individuals to understand that there are many, many, many reasons why a baby may be exposed to alcohol in utero and every sort of family history is different. But what I’ll, what I will say is that predominantly we have a large cohort of individuals that live with FASD because there was late pregnancy recognition in the, in the sense that the mother and father didn’t know that the woman was pregnant. That just, she didn’t know. And then when she did know, and this is the case in my family, in the case with my mother’s pregnancy with me, as soon as she found out that she was pregnant with me, she stopped drinking. But, you know, she didn’t know she was pregnant for the first several weeks. And that’s all it takes. That’s really all it takes. And and having, and I want women to have that awareness. I want women to know that even in low levels, this does cause damage. And we have to be really mindful of contraception.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah, that’s a really important point because I think part of the, unfortunately, stigma and shame that surrounds FASD so often is around, you know, thinking poorly about the mother or the parent who drank and how could you do that? It’s like, well, understand that people don’t know they’re pregnant, like the second they get pregnant. And as you said, that’s all it takes is to, you know, really, you stop as soon as you know, but sometimes, you know, the impact has already been had.

So yeah, it’s important.

Jessica Birch: Absolutely. And it’s so important. So a lot of and, and I’ve been part of this wonderful campaign that Australia launched in I think it was November, 2021. And it’s called the Every Moment Matters campaign. It’s the largest like a alcohol and pregnancy awareness campaign that we’ve ever done in Australia. And it’s been hugely successful. The reason it’s called Every Moment Matters is to express to people that, that from the point of conception, you must not have alcohol in your system. And so it’s like, if you’re planning or trying for a pregnancy or feel like you may become pregnant, stop. Stop before you’re pregnant.

And now this is a very, can be a very helpful piece of information and message and, and sort of awareness for individuals who, you know, might just be socially or casually drinking. We do need different services and different understanding for women who might be suffering or struggling with alcohol use disorder. That needs a really, a supportive wraparound service to help make sure that women that might be struggling with those sorts of, misuse disorders are supported are protected as much as they can and are supported as much as they can to have the healthiest and safest pregnancy, not only for the baby, but for themselves as well.

Yeah, but what we do see is a huge amount of stigma. And, and I speak about low and moderate levels and the, the, like the, the prevalence of late pregnancy recognition because it tends to be othered. There’s always this othering, you know, that it happens to other women, that it happens to other children, and it happens in certain community groups and stuff. And that none of that is true. Not only is it, is it anecdotally untrue, but it’s statistically untrue as well.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah. That’s a really important point for people to realize that, you know, it really can affect almost anyone who consumes alcohol at any point in time.

So, yeah.

Jessica Birch: Wherever alcohol is consumed, FASD exists. It just, it, it does. But with awareness, with education, with understanding, we can minimize it.

Carolyn Kiel: Well, Jessica, yep. Thank you so much for sharing your story and, and educating us all more about FASD and, and the impacts and, and a general education about it.

How can people get in touch with you if they want to learn more about your advocacy?

Jessica Birch: so I think a good way to see things that I do is, of course, jumping on the socials. So I do have a Twitter and an Instagram page. I have to admit that I can be a little bit on and off on my socials, but I am working on it. I’m working on, I’m working on a bit more of a regular online presence. But if you have a look at, at JB Talks FASD, that’s a sure fire way to find me. Anyone who would like to speak with me or learn a little bit more about what I’ve been doing and my advocacy please feel free to email me at jessicabirch dot FASD at gmail dot com. I’m currently also just finalizing my website. And I’m pretty sure that it’s www.JBTalksFASD.com.au. And absolutely, I’m always open to questions and suggestions of what you might like to hear from me on socials. And please give me a follow. It really makes me happy. It does support the work that I’ve been doing. And, yeah.

Carolyn Kiel: Great. That’s fantastic. I’ll put those links in the show notes so that people can click on them when they’re listening to this episode and follow you from there. As we close out, is there anything else that you’d like our listeners to know or anything they can help or support you with?

Jessica Birch: I guess I’d like listeners to understand that there is a lot of overlap of symptoms between other neuro sort of divergent, diagnoses. And it’s always important to ask the questions, not only for an individual that you might be caring for or, or your child, but for yourself as an individual to get a full picture.

So, it can be very difficult. It’s, I’m not, I’m not saying that these are not difficult questions to be asked, but I, I strongly recommend that having a full picture allows for the right things to, to be put in place for you in your life and allows for better understanding of what you might be experiencing. So I, I definitely will say that.

The other thing, what would I like? What would I like other things for listeners to know? I guess that the stigma is real. It’s always important to ask the question, but it’s also always important that when you meet someone that might be struggling a little bit in the, in a conversation or seems like they need a little bit of extra help that just, it might be something else that you can’t see, you know? And that just to hold compassion for the people we don’t know what their experience is.

Carolyn Kiel: No, it’s really important to remember. So yeah. Thanks again, Jessica, for sharing your story. I really enjoyed meeting you and talking with you today. So thank you so much for being on the show.

Jessica Birch: Thank you so much for having me, Carolyn. It was a pleasure.

Carolyn Kiel: Thanks for listening to Beyond 6 Seconds. Please help me spread the word about this podcast. Share it with a friend, give it a shout out on your social media, or write a review on Apple Podcasts or your favorite podcast player. You can find all of my episodes and sign up for my free newsletter at Beyond6seconds.net. Until next time.