Episode 140: Life with cerebral palsy – education, athletics & disability advocacy with Travis Davis

• When he was a substitute teacher, why he encouraged his students to ask him questions about his disability
• The chance meeting on an airplane that introduced him to wheelchair basketball
• Why he started his “Off The Crutch Podcast” about his experiences with cerebral palsy

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*Disclaimer: The views, guidance, opinions, and thoughts expressed in Beyond 6 Seconds episodes are solely mine and/or those of my guests, and do not represent those of my employer or other organizations.*

The episode transcript is below.

Carolyn Kiel: Hello, and welcome to the Beyond 6 Seconds podcast. I’m your host, Carolyn Kiel. And on today’s episode, I’m really happy to be speaking with my guest. Travis Davis. Travis is a native New Mexican, a TEDx speaker and local disability advocate. He was also born with cerebral palsy or CP. He has a bachelor’s degree in English, a master’s degree in adapted physical education, and is ADA coordinator certified. In his free time, Travis enjoys writing and recording his Off the Crutch podcast about his experiences with cerebral palsy and interviews local and national disability advocates. Travis, welcome to the podcast.

Travis Davis: Thank you so much for having me.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah, I’m really excited to learn more about your story and all of the great work that that you’ve been doing. What inspired you to start sharing your story about growing up and living with cerebral palsy?

Travis Davis: Yeah. That’s such a great question. You know, about 10 years or so, when I was finishing up my undergrad degree at Azusa Pacific University in Southern California, I formed a student organization and it was called the Disabled Students Organization. And it was birthed by a few friends that I didn’t really know at the time very well, but I had shared my story with them one day that I met them when I was eating lunch. And literally the next day or the day after I heard a knock on my apartment and it was the same girls that I had lunch with and they wrote down a list of ideas that they wanted to help me bring to fruition. And it wasn’t anything that I asked them to do, or it wasn’t even ideas that I had. I just literally was sharing my story. So that’s how the group got started. And then from there it continued within the next year and that’s when I realized, I guess, the power of my story and how I could use my disability to not only help other students on campus who had physical disabilities, but other students that wanted to learn more about disabilities.

And so after I graduated, I came back to New Mexico and then I started substitute teaching at the school that I graduated high school at. That was such a great experience for me the first time that I was in the classroom. And what I noticed during my time as a sub for three years was how much the students were so curious about asking me questions about my disability and why I use crutches, a wheelchair. A lot of the students had no idea what cerebral palsy was, and so I had the opportunity to share my story in the classroom. And I thought, what a great way in how important it is in a school-age environment where there’s so much negativity, bullying, you know, all these things that are going on in the schools, even before the pandemic. So that’s when I thought, the more that I can share, the more that these kids can have empathy about how they’re interacting with their peers, or if they see somebody with a physical disability outside the classroom, they can approach them in a, a very open manner.

So shortly after I finished substitute teaching, I started my master’s degree at the University of New Mexico. And the first few months in, I just finished a presentation in my sports sociology course. And it was on social inclusion in sports and the importance of inclusion with individuals with disabilities and those with not, and how the two go together and promote inclusion, while I saw a call for speakers at a local TEDx event.

And so I just thought, what the heck, I will apply. So instead of using the presentation for social inclusion in sports, I switched it to social inclusion in education, and that’s where I got the idea for the, my TEDx talk. And I think that was really the jumping off point of, this is how I’m going to share my story and not be so hesitant to do so.

Carolyn Kiel: That’s great. And the students, when you were substitute teaching, what grade was that?

Travis Davis: So the school that I graduated from, it was actually, it goes from sixth through 12th grade, but I was only there for high school. So I I was working with all the age groups. So sixth grade, all the way up to 12th. It seemed that the younger kids were the ones that had more questions for whatever reason. I think that’s just how kids are. The younger they are, the more curious they can be. There are different conversations, right? Because I can only speak at a certain level with younger kids. As they get older, more layers and different ways, and it just becomes a little bit more layered on how I can approach disability and the types of conversations that go along with it.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah. I was wondering about that because you know, kids, I guess at all ages are curious, I guess the younger they are, the more, maybe the more comfortable kids are with asking questions.

And then by the time you get to high school, I think sometimes, you know, high school can be a tough time. So everybody’s just kind of, you know, very aware of, you know, what they’re asking and they’re kind of thinking about themselves half the time. So yeah, I was curious, but that’s great that, you know, you were able to create an environment where you welcomed those questions and really helped the kids feel comfortable asking questions and to really learn more about disability and what it looks like in the world.

Travis Davis: Definitely. You know, I’ve, I’ve actually substitute taught more than I’ve had my own classroom, which is just sort of an interesting educational journey that I’ve been on, but it wasn’t necessarily something that I guess I chose. You know, with disabilities, there’s so many factors that go into employment and how much you can make and have to keep into your bank account without losing your medical benefits. And so there’s so much that I could dive into.

But I just want to say that being a sub it’s interesting because when, before I even started to substitute teach, I was kind of terrified. And then I would hear like horror stories about, oh my gosh, you know, kids can be so bad when you sub and this and that. But, you know, really, I never had in all my years in the classroom, I never had a bad day where I came home and went, “man, these kids really did a number on me today.” And you know what, in some ways, even when I had somewhat of a, of a bad day, it would actually make me happy. And this is, this is why. Because when I go out into the world, let’s say like outside of my house, and if I’m going out in public, there are instances where I feel different because people, when I say people, kids will stare, maybe adults would go out of their way to open doors, do things that they normally wouldn’t do for but another person that doesn’t have a disability, right? So being in the classroom was like the only time that I felt normal. So I actually would maybe a little bit worried if the kids were treating me differently. In the way that, like, let’s say that they were super quiet every time I walked in because of my disability. But the fact that they looked beyond that and they just saw me as just another substitute teacher was kind of cool.

And so it’s kind of a weird thing to say, but to be treated just like everybody else that they come in contact with I think was, was good. But at the same time, that doesn’t give them an excuse to be disrespectful. And I don’t think they were ever disrespectful to me. They were just, you know, loud, like they would be with another substitute teacher.

Carolyn Kiel: So in that context, you felt like in some ways, the kids just treated you like they would treat any other substitute teacher.

Travis Davis: Exactly. Yeah. And so it was like, okay. Over the years I have had comments about how much they’ve enjoyed having me into the classroom. And even at some points saying that I taught them better than their regular teacher, which is a great compliment to have, nothing that I go around saying, because I think that teachers are trying to do the best that they can.

So, you know, I’m just there to fill the void and provide whatever I can during the time I’m in the classroom.

Carolyn Kiel: That’s great. And I know with COVID, we’re in kind of a strange educational situation. Do you still substitute teach, or is that with the virtual world, is that still a structure that happens now?

Travis Davis: No. And so I was substitute teaching up until March of last year, right before COVID hit. And then everything went virtual and they did, you know, they didn’t need subs when everything’s remote. And you know, this year they asked me to come back. But because of the restrictions on, on how how much I, I would need to be at school even if I wasn’t needed, it just didn’t make a whole lot of sense. And I’ve been doing some consulting work the last half of the year, which has been really good for me to start working again. So I haven’t.

But I’ve also thought about ways where I can still teach, but not so much in the traditional sense. And I think that’s what COVID has really showed a lot of teachers and educators, and maybe even students, that being taught in the confines of four walls isn’t necessarily needed or the best way. So there’s so much content right now, like on YouTube and different platforms where you can be educated. And I think that’s something that I want to continue to look into.

Carolyn Kiel: Very cool. So, yeah, it’s now been a couple years since you’ve done your TEDx speech, and I know you continue to be a speaker on and sharing your story and talking about disability and, and issues surrounding that. Is that part of the way that you’re continuing to teach, even though you can’t be in like a physical classroom all the time, like before COVID?

Travis Davis: Yeah. I, I think that has really helped me. A couple of months ago, I was in Phoenix for a disability expo called the Abilities Expo, and it’s a trade show for individuals with disabilities. My first day there, I wasn’t intending to be involved in any capacity, but it just turned out that there was a hole in the schedule where one of the speakers, they couldn’t, I guess they had dropped out. And so I had offered to give a workshop later that afternoon. And so that was really cool. And they asked me to do it again next month at the Abilities Expo in Dallas.

So these types of speaking opportunities have been really, really cool. And I just want to continue doing it in that way. I’m involved locally as the chair of our ADA advisory council, and that’s allowed me to listen to others in the community who have disabilities and see how the council can help them with their needs.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah, that’s great. Yeah, we’ve really had to get creative, especially since the pandemic started in terms of how we communicate with people. And I know like a lot, like the virtual interview we’re doing now, you know, I was, I’ve always done my podcast virtually, but I think just more and more that’s just video and these other, you know, smaller conferences and traveling when we can are just different ways to get our messages out.

Another big part of your life, as I understand it, is around physical education and athletics, and, you know, you have a master’s in physical education and I know sports has been a pretty big part of your life growing up. And yeah, you played quite a lot around basketball or wheelchair basketball, so I’d love to learn more about kind of how you found your, your love and your passion for physical education.

Travis Davis: Sure. Yeah, that’s a wonderful question. And so my introduction to wheelchair basketball was kind of like a fluke, because up until I was 12, 13 years old, I didn’t know anybody with any type of disability. There was nobody at my school with a disability. And so, my parents were coming back from a sales meeting from St. Louis. And when they were on the plane, my mom noticed this crutch and it was the bottom of the crutch and it looked kind of different than the bottom of the crutch that I have. And so she was mentioning it to my dad, that they needed to get like a pair of those for me.

And I guess there was a a young boy that overheard my mom say that and asked my mom if I had a disability. And she said, yeah. And so he had reached out and asked if I’d be interested in coming to a wheelchair basketball practice. So it turned out there was a wheelchair basketball team that was coming back from a a team tournament and they were on the same flight. And so my parents came back, told me about the wheelchair basketball, and then that’s how I started playing. I got involved. We traveled all across the country. We went to nationals a couple of times. The highest that we ever placed was ninth in the country. They took the top 16 teams from around the country, on the junior and collegiate level.

And yeah, it was a really great experience for me to be around other people with disabilities. And it’s, it’s a interesting experience to be in a, a gym or even a convention center where the minority is the majority. And so when you have tons of people in wheelchairs and, and you know, they’re just doing their thing, they’re being independent, it’s something where you can see, you know, when I was younger and seeing these teenagers that were 18, 19 years old, right, and seeing how independent they were, that signaled to me about how I could be like that someday. You know, they were individuals that I could look up to. So I was really glad for the opportunity to play wheelchair basketball.

And then over the years I got introduced to other adapted sports like wheelchair tennis, wheelchair lacrosse, therapeutic horseback riding, but that was something that I used to do when I was younger. Some other adaptive sports that I learned in my master’s program. And then there was a small period of time where I coached middle school volleyball and basketball when I was substitute teaching, and these kids that I was coaching, they didn’t have any type of disability.

So I really enjoyed coaching from that. That experience taught me so much and yeah, I just have so much admiration for coaches and just young adults that are mentors to the lives of children with and without disabilities.

Carolyn Kiel: That’s cool. Yeah. Your passion for teaching and coaching and mentoring and it all, it all ties together, it’s the same sentiment overall, is really is great. You know, both through, you know, education in the classroom, education and other things. And then just helping people really do their best in their sport. You know, whether or not they have a disability and at all different skill levels, I’m sure. So, that’s really great.

And I’m also hearing the importance again, of just representation and how important it was for you to be able to see people who were disabled, but were still playing sports or doing things. And just, even if it’s just one person. Just seeing like, oh, there’s someone else, I can aspire to that, or it’s something I can try and it opens up your mind.

And also the way that you helped educate your students and answer their questions. Because I, I feel like the representation of disability in the media or just in society, it’s, you know, either people just don’t see it or it’s represented in a very stereotypical way or very kind of narrow way. So it’s important to share those experiences.

Travis Davis: Yeah, you’re absolutely correct. And I think something that is a reality, but maybe a reality that not everybody wants to come to terms with, is that. And you might’ve heard this before, but disability’s the only minority that somebody can be a part of at any time. You know, you’re not gonna wake up tomorrow and be a different race, but you might wake up tomorrow and, you know, I use this example so much, like fall down the stairs or, you know, I’ve heard of individuals getting a stroke, or, you know, things that we don’t want to think about, things that we shouldn’t really be thinking about, but things that unfortunately happen. So while I don’t think that there’s one minority that is, there’s no like hierarchy of like, okay, we gotta focus on this minority and make sure that, you know, I think every minority’s equal in that sense. It gets a little tricky just because of with disability then comes into play the role of accessibility, right? And with the ADA only being 31 years old, this whole idea of accessibility wasn’t talked about as much prior to the law being passed. So and we’re still, and I say we, other people with disabilities are still working that out. And you know, I think we still have a long way to go, but with the more representation out there, like you mentioned, I think the better things are going to get.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah, absolutely. And yeah, I guess I tend to forget that the ADA is relatively recent, like, it really wasn’t that long ago that it got signed into law. So many important strides have been made since then around accessibility, but still, there’s still a lot of places that are not accessible, whether it’s by law they’re not required to be, or they’re just not doing it and they’re supposed to be, so, yeah, it really is a, it’s a continued, continued story there.

And so, in addition to doing your speaking and teaching and coaching, you also host a podcast called Off the Crutch podcast. You share your story there and I guess sometimes have interviews there as well? So what inspired you to start a podcast?

Travis Davis: Yeah. So I’ve been wanting to do a podcast for some time now.

And when I was 18, 19 years old, one of the professions that I was interested in getting into was music production. And so I had a keyboard at that time. Learning synthesizers and all that. And I, I did some music audio engineering, some recording with my laptop during that time. And things just kind of, kind of faded and went in different directions.

And but with the pandemic and being unemployed and collecting unemployment I had a lot of free time on my hands and I thought maybe this is the time that I could start a podcast. You know, editing and all that stuff wasn’t new to me because I would do that by working on my keyboard and making music. So it was really easy for me to pick up.

Trying to figure out like a name was interesting. And I just thought, well, you know, I use forearm crutches and, you know, off the cuff, I was like, off the crutch, maybe that works! So did that. Yeah, it started out with just me sharing about myself and I thought the best way to have the audience get introduced to me to learn more about me is to have my friends on, which I thought at the time was like a good way to look at it. Like, okay, I can interview my friends and then the listeners can kind of get to know me. And then things started to expand, and with my connections through LinkedIn I got interest in people wanting to be on my podcast. So it’s really shifted away from the people that know me and to the folks in the disability community who are doing great things.

So I think that is something where I’ve seen growth and evolved in such a way that you know, I can go to a trade show like the Abilities Expo and share my podcast and then have on guests and promote their stuff. You know, I would much rather, you know, listen to other people than to, I guess, talk myself. But I love, I love being on other people’s podcasts. But I just find people’s stories, and I’m sure you can relate to this, so interesting because especially when you don’t have to do interviews in person anymore, and you know, the internet is, you got millions and millions of people. So there’s always going to be an infinite number of individuals to interview. So that’s where my podcast is at right now.

Carolyn Kiel: Very cool. And that’s very similar to when I started my podcast is I had my friends on first because for me it was, you know, you’re learning and it’s like, well, I’ll be more comfortable with them. And I, I kinda know their stories a little so I can ask them questions and then like, they won’t be upset at me if I like forget to hit record some point. And so, and then as you know, just like in your story, it really grew beyond, you know, my friend circle. I found a lot of people through LinkedIn as well. And, and really, yeah, now that we’re in this virtual world, you can interview people from really any, almost any country almost anywhere. So it’s, it’s been great. I’ve met a lot of great people and I imagine you have as well.

Travis Davis: Yeah, it’s been really cool. And I think one of the neat things about having a disability, some people might disagree who have disabilities, and that is fine, is that there’s so many ways to tie in disabilities with other mediums. So there’s people who have disabilities that are interested in the arts, or like interested in religion, or I saw like a group with astronomy. And there’s just so many interesting people that I think with my podcast, there’s always people I can tie, tie it to. I can always find like a hook. Even if there’s somebody that’s struggling with finding a job or a career, you know, I can find a career coach or a career coach who has a disability. Or even a mom who just had a child with a disability, like they need to hear this stuff too. So I think that’s where it’s like so infinite and where I, I think I can turn my disability from a negative to a positive.

Carolyn Kiel: And just a totally new and different medium to share your story and other people’s stories and really just, you know, open up that, that world and that representation so that people get to meet, even if it’s virtually meet, other disabled people and learn their stories and learn more about their experiences.

Travis Davis: Definitely. Yeah, of course.

Carolyn Kiel: Long-term, do you have any sort of big like aspirational goals for either your, your speaking or your podcast, or really any, any of the work that you’re doing currently?

Travis Davis: Oh man, yeah, that’s a loaded question. I hadn’t really thought about it during the pandemic because things were just so, they were moving so slow. And I think as soon as 2021 hit, things have just been going so fast. Because we’ve gotten the vaccine, more people have been getting vaccinated and things are opening up. So now I’m really taking a look at what I want to accomplish. I think writing a book at some point would be really good. Writing like an online course. I’m trying to do some more consulting and just getting, getting back out there in front of people.

But I’d also like to strengthen the online community that I have through LinkedIn or just folks that are interested in wanting to learn more about disability. I also think a long-term goal would be to do bigger speaking events and really coming up with a presentation that not only benefits people, but that they can actually take away something and apply it to their lives. I think it’s good to be inspirational, but unless somebody is helping them do something with that, I think that’s the tricky part and that’s kind of what I’m struggling with. So if, if I can start out with a book first and go from there, I think that would be a good goal.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah, that’s great. Yeah. You need that, that call to action at the end, at the end of the speech, like, okay, what do I do to apply this? Or what do I do differently? Or what do I do new? Yeah, absolutely.

Travis Davis: Exactly.

Carolyn Kiel: Travis, thank you so much for sharing today. How can people get in touch with you if they want to learn more about the type of speaking or other type of work?

Travis Davis: They can go to a couple websites. Go to TravisDavis.net, T R A V I S D A V I S dot net. They could also go to EqualSteps.org. That is my LLC, even though it’s dot org, it’s a for-profit, so they can go to EqualSteps.org, and they can also go to OffTheCrutch.com if they want to listen to the podcast.

But they can find all of my social media links on the on TravisDavis.net. It’s just travismdavis if you want to find me on Instagram, Facebook. But yeah, I am pretty open and willing to help anybody that reaches out.

Carolyn Kiel: That’s awesome. And I’ll put links to your website and podcast in the show notes so people can find it there too.

Travis Davis: I appreciate that. Thank you so much, Carolyn.

Carolyn Kiel: Sure. And as we close out, is there anything else that you’d like our listeners to know or anything specific that they can help or support you with?

Travis Davis: Yeah. Another great question. I really think that, I think if people can understand that disability is not like a one size fits all. I think sometimes, especially like in social media, I think people think that if there’s somebody with 500,000 followers and they’re posting disability content, that they have, like the answers because they have such a big following. You know, I think that’s something that most people don’t realize. So like with me, when I speak, or if somebody hears me and they take away and they say like, “oh my gosh, you’re so right!” Or, you know, you know, they want answers. And I think most of the time, my responses I hope give more questions than answers. Because I don’t ever want to be like, “right.” My experiences are my experiences. And so even if I have 500 followers, somebody has, you know, a hundred times more than me, that person doesn’t have more answers. Their stuff isn’t more credible than me. So I just try to be myself and not let all that other stuff get in the way. So I just look at it like, I’m just interacting with one person at a time.

Carolyn Kiel: Yeah. That’s important to keep in mind that disability is not a monolith. Like everyone has their own experiences and it’s all different. Absolutely important to listen to everyone’s stories. Well, thank you so much, Travis. It’s been great talking with you today and thanks so much for sharing your story.

Travis Davis: Thank you so much. I really appreciate it.

Carolyn Kiel: Thanks for listening to Beyond 6 Seconds. Please help us spread the word about this podcast. Share it with a friend. Give us a shoutout on your social media or write a review on Apple Podcasts or your favorite podcast player. You can find all of our episodes on our website and sign up for our free newsletter at www.beyond6seconds.com. Until next time.